Simon Rattle interview: Brexit will kill orchestra tours
mainThe conductor has been talking to France 24:
‘The practical difficulties will be immense because there never was any planning for Brexit,’ he said. ‘Whenever we ask (government officials) what the situation will be with taking instruments from country to country, the answer is, ‘Sorry? we have no idea.’
‘We have three or four contingency plans for every tour now… Last Friday we played in Frankfurt, and we were in Paris on Saturday. If all the instruments have to be inspected… there is no way they would have got from one country to another.
He added that customs checks and form-filling ‘takes 15 hours on average, which means our touring life is completely different.’
Read on here.
On the other hand, some of us think orchestras should help save the planet and stop excessve touring. Orchestras, conductors and soloists need to see the bigger picture and reconfigure their activity.
I can understand that he’s upset by the Brexit. But I don’t believe that it will prevent the LSO or the London Philarmonic to go in France or Germany. Those orchestras are attractives.
I too am an attractive.
As he said, just a matter of planning. No big deal, maybe the transition from country to country will take an extra day, but that’s it. More paperwork? Yes. More time and less concerts? Yes. The country chose, so they have it. Stop whining, too late for that and move on.
Good luck with that.
Sorry but that totally misses the point. The margin on yours is tiny. Every day an orchestra plays without a concert means no income for that day. An extra day in a tour schedule might wipe out any “profit” from doing the tour. One day is all it takes to make a tour untenable.
Welcome to my (former) world in private business; government put every single obstacle imaginable in our way yet we managed – by sheer force of will – to survive. Not without huge amounts of hard work and determination.
Indeed! It was made hard and challenging for you; so if everyone else doesn’t suffer massive scheduling and financial inconveniences voted for by people who won’t be affected by such things, that’s just not good enough!
Spot on!
Simon and these orchestras are simply dealing with the additional security necessitated by 9/11 and ongoing radical Muslim extremists attacks. That’s all.
Every country has always had to uphold their own standards. Orchestras are of course glad of this as they are less likely to be exposed to undesirables who would threaten or harm them.
Orchestras should also be eliminating their ‘carbon footprints’ as their air travel constantly contributes to global warming/climate change, etc.
Jolly good!
Yes, move on. Rejoin the EU.
The old people of England wanted out. No other demographics wanted in its majority to leave.
Why do old people decide for next generations?
That Referendum… A British idiocy of historic dimensions.
Scotland will secede and rejoin the EU. Northern Ireland will join Ireland.
“A British idiocy of historic dimensions”………..Amen
In that case, perhaps young people should show how concerned they are by bothering to vote occasionally.
In 2015 and 2017 for example, turnout among the youngest voters was between 40% and 50%. Unimpressive.
https://ichef.bbci.co.uk/news/624/cpsprodpb/130F2/production/_99766087_general_turnout_640-nc.png
Totally agree. That’s the other side of the same medal. But mostly irrational ‘Make Britain great again’ nostalgia of the old and underprivileged English drove the referendum. The old were turned on (and voted), the young were turned off. Never was the saying “Nationalism is the last refuge of the scoundrel” more true than in that referendum.
Typical loser reaction. Get over it.
Yes, that’s the trouble with democracy; the people we dislike get to vote. Why do we have to tolerate such oiks and deplorables? Why can’t they be as virtuous and enlightened as we are? Surely the next thing is an IQ test before voting and being the right racial ‘stock’.
(Mmm; now, where have I heard that before?) There’s always eugenics, if the democratic result doesn’t suit you. We’re seeing withdrawal of ‘loser consent’ so this may be the next big thing.
Watch your words. If the wider public was to vote directly on particular cultural issues, you would not have any concert halls to go to, no opera houses, no publicly funded orchestras…
But they don’t and never have, so your words are merely rhetoric. And I’m speculating that many of those who voted for Brexit are also music-lovers, despite their ridicule from the “oikophobes”.
The wider public might not have often voted directly on such issues as how to support the arts, correct. But some stupid politician thought it is a good idea to ask the public about a most complex issue of international collaboration and trade, custom and monetary unions. Now that is an issue the wider public is really competent about. “We want no stinking krauts or frog eaters to tell us what to do.”
Pure political genius.
There is not a single tangible advantage for the British population in Brexit. Or can you name one?
I knew you couldn’t name even a single tangible advantage of Brexit for the people. Tragic…
I have met so many people that have never been inside a concert hall
Or theatre. Their entertainment is eating out.
“Northern Ireland will join Ireland.”
Don’t hold your breath.
Opinion polls suggest a narrow majority for joining the republic. England has, more-or-less, told Northern Ireland to “get lost” in order to secure Brexit as it has placed a customs border in the Irish Sea.
Perhaps you would like to set up some “camps” for us oldies………..but wait, I seem to recall this being tried before when a group decided that those of a certain religious belief should be got rid of! I do not decide for the next generation, but as someone worked has worked for 53 years, paid my taxes, never used the NHS Hospital Service (other than working in it for seven years) and hardly ever been unemployed, I do think I have some say in the way this country is governed. So when you have grown up, matured a little then come back and put forward some of your other radical thinking!
Yes, there are many people rushing into the showers or drinking the Cool Aid of anti-deplorable-ism. I expect these same ‘deplorables’ to redeem themselves later this year and turf out Donald Trump with both hands. But wait? My son had a conversation at a sporting match, in the corporate box, with the MD of a major international gas company (within the last 2 weeks) and he’s from the US: “the American economy is absolutely going gang-busters” he said.
My son replied, “exactly the right time to be giving Trump the heave-ho”!!
This is so dumb. Breathtakingly so.
Yes, exactly. Maybe play more at home than go flitting off all the time to Europe. Orchestras have been going far further afield for years anyhow with no trouble.
As i wrote before i have never seen the great Philharmonia here in manchester
It seems more important to tour the far east which has no european tradition
Where classical music is concerned.
“Last Friday we played in Frankfurt, and we were in Paris on Saturday. If all the instruments have to be inspected… there is no way they would have got from one country to another.”
Not sure I understand. Germany and France are both in the Schengen zone. Why should there be an inspection between Frankfurt and Paris?
and surely the new customs arrangements wouldn’t take effect until December anyway. So there is time to sort it out.
Probably because the British musicians are NOT going to be in either Schengen or EU.
Some confusion here.
Britain is not, and never has been, part of the Schengen zone.
But the scenario described here by the Maestro concerns a trip from Frankfurt to Paris. Anyone making that trip can do so without border checks, regardless of nationality. This is not about to change.
Exactly. There is only one customs check, and that is between Britain and the EU. And that happening depends on what is agreed by the 31 Dec deadline.
No. That there are no border checks does not necessarily mean there is free flow of goods between Schengen countries for non-EU parties.
“seeing the bigger picture”
What has that got to do with BREXIT?
well, Brexit has all to do with NOT seeing the bigger picture. (and being proud of it)
Liberal whining about their current victim label “climate change”
As if conductors and orchestras don’t collectively waste huge amounts of petrol and paper every year…ugh.
Some people are arrogant enough to think that they can control the forces of nature in relation to planet earth without accepting the cycle of all forms of life.
It’s a STAR folks; they ALL BURN OUT after awhile just like everybody is going to kick off.
Just have a good time, BUY some music and go shag somebody!
The LSO should tour more inside the UK going to places like Londonderry, Hull, Aberystwyth, Dundee.
You are right when are they coming to Manchester it has been a long time since they came. More important than going overseas we live in the U.K. we want to see them. Some of us are disabled it is hard to get to London .
Every orchestra should play more for culturally deprived audiences.
Derry. Which hopefully won’t be in the UK much longer.
Londonderry????
The LSO played there several years ago.
No need, Dundee have RSNO.
What does inside UK actually mean?
So should all UK orchestras.
“Touring the provinces.” Also bring back grotty boarding houses for the “artistes.” And make sure the halls are cold and damp. Like the Good Old Days.
Not true here in manchester we some good hotels. 75 years ago it was bad
So ronnie Scott says in his biography
Olassus.
It’s more expensive to tour in the UK than in the Eurozone and rest of the world.
Problem with LSO they want those nice premium prices and fees they can get overseas ! People won’t pay the crazy prices it would set in UK cities outside London
On the bright side, they’ll be eating plenty of bangers and mash in the LSO cafeteria now that the UK is isolating itself from the rest of the world. Enjoy your time in Little Britain.
Bangers and mash? Lucky we can even get a coffee at the Barbican artists bar.
Little loser georgy
His job now is to make the best of things and be a leader – and stop catastrophising. Where will advantage come? What needs to change?Am I the right person for the task?
==The LSO should tour more inside the UK going to places like Londonderry, Hull, Aberystwyth, Dundee.
That’s a good point !
Maybe he is mentally preparing for his personal breakaway from the depressing Motherland. He already lives in Germany.
They had a good time together in Munich recently I heard.
They will also build a new hall there. And sooner.
Catastrophism is the new religion of our post-Christian age. It seems people need a ‘belief’ in something and today this is it. I find it amusing and ironic!!
We remind you of your words about “catastrophism’, next time you freak out about refugees again. Ironic indeed.
orchestra touring is BIG business…… start there and then realise if it is also useful to publics. Orchestras should serve their own people. This touring madness must stop.
“serve their own people.”
This disease of tribalism is hard to defeat.
Who are the music’s own people?
Are there borders in music?
Barenboim’s West-Eastern Diwan has thus no justification to exist, because it has no affiliation to one people? To the contrary. It is one of the most important orchestras on this planet, because…
And on the other other hand, some of us don’t think orchestras should help save the planet.
Maestro Simon just told the truth. I can not imagine even 120+ orchestra with their respective instruments being checked in…just madness and a total lack of imagination…
Well if Simon said it…
Pretty ironic that this day and the 83rd birthday of the composer of so much brooding, melancholic, and strangely luminous music should coincide. Newcastle March from Satygagraha; 2nd mvt. of violin concerto; Prophecies from Koyaanisqatsi; Prelude to Akhnaten; much of the Dracula score…just a few examples.
Weird thing is, he knows this is just posturing. The LSO has a sizeable European tour programme lined up. They’ve obviously found a solution to these insuperable problems.
And does anyone – anyone? – think it’s good for an orchestra to be playing in Berlin one night and Paris the next, either for the audiences or the players?
There aren’t yet any serious problems because Britain has not yet left the EU regulatory environment. The British government has given itself until the end of the year to agree something. What is agreed may, or may not, cause serious problems for the LSO when it tours.
Orchestras tour non-EU countries all the time, and toured Europe before Britain was in the EC/EU, apparently all without excessive difficulty.
All this overwrought whinging by sour-grapes “remainers” needs to end. Move on Simon (I’m currently playing “My Heart Bleeds for You” on the world’s smallest fiddle).
In short, things will be the same as they were before the EU.
No, they really won’t be.
As horrible as it is to think that May might be the last time I hear Rattle and the LSO in New York, Rattle has a job to do. He couldn’t have not seen that something like this was possible, if he is a person of conscience, and I have to believe he is, then he has a responsibility to help shepherd the musicians of his home country, the musicians who trained him brought him to the height of fame, through their most trying period to the other side. The frustrations he feels is the same frustrations that all the musicians stuck in the UK or US feel every day. Rattle, whether he likes it or not, is their leader, they need his guidance, WE all over the world need his guidance. If he doesn’t set an example and stay in England when the going gets tough, his legacy will ultimately be little different from all those touring playboys like Maazel and Dutoit who thought so much less of what they could do for musicians and music than what music could do for them.
Great Performers at Lincoln Center for season 2020/21 was announced a few days ago. May 2020 won’t be the last time that you hear the LSO and Rattle in New York. I am a US citizen, and agree that Brexit is a colossal, foolish mistake. But European orchestras seem to manage touring to the USA, American orchestras regularly visit Europe, and both regularly visit China and Japan. None of this should change because of Brexit.
The perfect time then for the UK government to invite the Tehran Symphony Orchestra to the UK for a tour. Music heals all, the great elixier.
I’d think presenting organizations that host international ensembles, such as the Proms, are far more worried.
The vote on Brexit was three years ago. Some people should have been anticipating that this would happen. If you need extra days between performances then that is what you must do to deal with red tape. It’s time to stop whining and put some thought into the new way orchestras will need to deal with this situation.
Like there was no touring whatever before 1973 ? Please stop wasting our time with these inanities. Rattle should go away and play his piccolo.
The best way to reduce one’s carbon footprint would be to stop eating, in view of all the food transported by lorry or plane. This reduction would mean Sir Simon could spend all his time travelling around Europe with his orchestra as there’d be no English audiences any more.
Huh????
US and Asian musicians and orchestras have managed without being part of the EU – ever. Rattle comes across as a whiner. Move with the times, like it or not.
Rattle is an utter bore ! Whining about something that was sure to happen after a vote 3 half years ago ! Of course he was one of those who thought it would be overturned ! Stick to your responsibility and try improve your interpretations of British music. Which has a lot to be desired !
What a mean and unfair post! Sir Simon is the UK’s greatest treasure.
I cannot understand him leaving the great berlin philharmonic. It is like
Selling your ferrari for a skoda
Is Rattle the voice of the LSO these days?
I am in total agreement with those who have stated that the yeahs for Brexit were largely the older generation. And who benefits least from
Brexit? The older generation! Those whom Brexit will really affect should have had a weighted vote.
Democracy does not exist in Britain or the USA. One man one vote means nothing when there is an outdated constituency system and an electoral college.
It’s time both systems are changed and brought into the 21st century, despite the inevitable rearguard actions of those who benefit from the present systems.