CBSO’s 2024 edit erases western classical music
OrchestrasMessage from the City of Birmingham Symphony Orchestra, posted on Youtube:
Thank you to everyone who’s supported the CBSO this past year. We can’t wait to bring you even more joy in 2025!
Before the year comes to a close, take a look back at some of our highlights:
Not one chord of music from the CBSO’s core mission.
Is this fine orchestra still committed to the European canon, or has classical music been autocratically decolonised?
Never mind all that boring European stuff, CBSO musicians are now available for children’s parties throughout 2025.
Nothing is considered too demeaning.
Old white men complaining again, Surprise Surprise.
Emma has Made Clear that the CBSO has to be Relevant for Everyone, not just for white people. Have you never looked how many Black and Asian people are in Birmingham?
Your comments are disgusting.
What I find even worse, though, is that it is impossible to tell the difference between your comments and those by Emma Stenning, CBSO’s new CEO.
Two people (or the same person) who clearly hate music and those who truly enjoy it.
Hi Allegra!
You can say what you want but you’re Out Of Touch with our New Direction.
We love ALL MUSIC not just your little genre.
You can come On Board for our Journey or stay away, your Choice.
“Old white men complaining again, Surprise Surprise.”
Although I was born in Pitlochry, my father is half ethnically Indian and my mother is Han Chinese from Taiwan. Neither has any problem with “relevance”.
You managed to get the “old” bit right.
You’re an exception Iain. Yes you converted to white dead men music but how about the CBSO also converts to Relevant, Representative music?
It’s Rude to expect People of Colour to listen to white music, how dare you say that?
Emma is a pioneer and you will be Left Behind.
“Yes you converted to white dead men music”
Why are you assuming that I must have started off somewhere else?
Doing what exactly? Playing bagpipes in an Indian/Chinese style in strict accordance with my ethnicity and then miraculously “converting” to Beethoven?
Your comments here are the most racist by a significant margin, or just plain deranged. I can’t decide which.
Usual silly response from ‘I support Emma’. The vast majority of Black and Asian people prefer other kinds of music. So how do you make orchestral music relevant to them if they don’t like it?
Simple answer: play Black and Asian music, not white music! It’s easy to do, borrow some of the old music players and bring in some New ones outside of the orchestra: Flexibility and Relevance for all Genres.
This is all satire, right? Either that or “I Support Emma” is irredeemably racist.
Curious. Please explain how western Classical music is not relevant to Asian or black audiences? I’ve certainly enjoyed plenty of non-Western performances (not ‘shows’!) in both western concert hall and emic contexts and felt that if I was embedding myself in a local culture it was my responsibility to make the local culture as relevant to myself as possible, apart from the universality of the emotive aspect of music appreciation. Therefore, one can only deduce that your argument stems from 1) someone gate keeping the western tradition and telling these audiences it is somehow not relevant to them or 2) these audiences deliberately excluding themselves on their own volition, then looking for excuses to do so. Either way, it seems seems rather narrow-minded.
I think “I Support Emma” is actually a comic in the mold of Titania McGrath.
If it is so that this is comedy, the person behind it has totally overdone it, exploiting a controversy fraught with extreme passions with repetitive, seemingly obsessive, horrific statements. It isn’t particularly droll, as Titania McGrath can be, and the satirist, if so s/he be, should KNOCK IT OFF. (And as I said before, to a perplexing number of downvotes, Ms. Stenning should be vigorously disavowing I Support if she doesn’t agree with him or her). Enough already! Consider the proposition that the
Race Bomb, as Malcolm X said, has more energy than the A Bomb.
That’s my hunch as well.
Old White Men’s fears are exectly what they did to others: being wiped out and erased.
Karma.
Jumping right to racist accusations.
You people can’t crawl back under your rocks and be ignored quickly enough.
Emma Stenning is seriously deluded. She thinks all it takes to sell out Symphony Hall is put Qawwali music over a highlights reel and get members of the orchestra to wear silly t-shirts with ‘C B S O’ in big letters.
We ordered those t shirts for All Members of Staff to make the orchestra more welcoming. The musicians also love wearing them and have asked if they can be used for All Concerts (even the traditional ones) going forwards. We are Aiming to do this from the Proms and then the Next Season in September!
Yeah, sure the orchestra asked to wear them for all concerts, even the ones without random capitals. You are making things up.
It’s a pleasure to play in an orchestra where management (=Emma) has this contempt for us and our music.
What else can we expect after she told our audiences to take some drinks in so they don’t get bored during our “show” (as she calls them)?
I would love to know a) if this comment really does come from CBSO members and b) what CBSO members really think.
It may be time for the orchestra to speak out? Maybe they love all this nonsense?
You’re so pathetic, saying your concert isn’t just a show
You’ll be the first to go when Emma’s Preventative Efficiency Measures start, we already have too many Violins and there’s no place in this Organisation for negative people
Threatening your own orchestra members? There’s nice.
What a poor, deluded arse you really are. Maybe you need to take time to re~read some of the comments you have made here and decide, for yourself, how they actually come across.
Good lord, do you people not know a troll when you see one? Random capital letters? Preventative Efficiency Measures? “We already have too many violins” ?
Can you not tell this person is clearly having you on?
Get woke, go broke.
Those taking the supposedly virtuous role in these tiresome disputes overlook that no one comes to a concert space to hear crappy music. And, say what you want, unlike much of the more “diverse,” contemporary music, the music of dead white males like Beethoven and Brahms is not crappy.
But you, the troll who is “I Support Emma,” whoever you are, you don’t like or study classical music, do you?
Oh dear. That’s a provocative video, maybe deliberately so.
Some Diversity would have brought more Inclusion, I feel. For example, why not include some shots of the amazing production of Tippett’s “New Year” with the CBSO in the Dream Tent?
And with no sight or sound of symphonic music, maybe it’s time for Emma to rebrand the orchestra as the CBO?
We are Looking Into a rebrand as part of the 5 year Plan! The Orchestra is Failing because it is not Relevant to the people of Birmingham, lots of Improvements are on the way.
CBSO is failing? It’s one of the best-regarded orchestras in Britain.
Now, where have I heard the phrase ‘Five Year Plan’ before…..?
I despair. As one young CBSO-supporting friend of mine says: it truly is dismal. How can they lack marketing acumen so badly?
What is WRONG with these people who market and administrate this great orchestra? Are they completely stupid?
Sniff. Sniff. Sniff.
Talk about tone deaf! Can only have been devised by someone who would much rather the symphony orchestra she is supposed to be leading were an entirely different kind of organisation. The sad irony is again, of course, that there were several absolutely tremendous concerts during the year which were genuine highlights and will abide in people’s memory – long after these anti-musical initiatives are buried in the sea of indifference they largely generate.
Exactly! Cornishman got lots (maybe too much) of his classical music but you all have a problem with the Diverse Shows? Selfish selfish selfish
In my opinion this is the problem with most orchestras these days-trying to be all things to all people rather than concentrating on core mission and avoiding the knee jerk reaction to program all this woke stuff. I’m sure many classically trained musicians feel demeaned. And let’s not forget the elimination of music education programs in many if not most schools. The downward spiral just continues.
Absolutely, a city orchestra, funded by the city, should be for all people in the city, especially given the loss of music education in schools. I’m shocked that you think of Indian classical music as ‘woke stuff’. The interaction between Indian and Western classical music goes back at least to Yehudi Menuhin and Ravi Shankar (West meets East, 1967).
And, for your information, 31% of Birmingham’s population was Asian/Asian British at the last census (2021), almost all from the Indian subcontinent.
Thanks for Sharing this! We want it all over Social Media. Helps Beki and Ruark out a lot. Even if the usual people complain
Proud to be Birmingham’s Orchestra for Everyone 🙂
Next month the orchestra is playing Debussy, Satie, Bridge, Mozart, Mendelssohn, Brahms, and Prokofiev.
What exactly is the problem?
These names are hardly anything to brag about… LSO has Boulez, George Benjamin, Tippett, Turnage in just the first half of the month.
It’s astounding that CBSO management looks at the orchestra and says ‘this is what we are most proud of for our end-of-year video’. But what else do you expect if you choose a CEO who brags about having no knowledge of music and not going to concerts until this job?A woman who says concerts are ‘improved’ with drinks, films and flashing lights?
There is a real risk under Stenning, the CBSO will go down the ‘easy classics’ + popular music route, a sad loss for Birmingham.
Norman questioned if the “orchestra still committed to the European canon”; the evidence clearly shows it is.
You people are trying so desperately hard to turn a 57 second video into some kind of evidence that the woke mind virus is destroying the CBSO.
If you look at their YouTube page (https://www.youtube.com/@TheCBSO/videos) you’ll see what they promote is almost exclusively the core repertoire.
The irony is that for all of the talk orchestras have about culturally responsive programming and such which gets you all in such a rage, at the end of the day, virtually all orchestras continue to overwhelmingly program the core Austro-German 19th century repertoire to a degree that most people complain is too conservative.
You miss the point AGAIN. THIS video is the one celebrating the year…. And it completely ignores their key performances and music. And I am not in a rage.
Hi Allegra! All of those names…they are for music nerds. It is Problematic because our job is to get the concert Money we can’t just appeal to niche classical music groups. Hence the Diverse Programming we are doing.
This is why we have in the next Quarter we have: Music At The Movies, Musical Magic, Black Voices, Where Are All The Black Female Composers?, Abbey Road Concerto 🙂 Are you Coming?
However to be Relevant to Everyone CBSO is also doing serious music for the specialists. There will be Romeo and Juliet, Brahms Symphony, Strauss Blue Danube, Florence Price Violin Concerto, William Grant Still, Puccini Nessun Dorma, Tchaikovsky Sleeping Beauty Waltz…
This means we are truly Birmingham’s Orchestra!
The video, obviously.
There. Got it yet?
57 seconds, the music was from the Orchestral Quawwali Project, the images showed various aspects of CBSO’s activities, including the mainstream classical ones.
Should symphony orchestras limit themselves to the European canon? That would certainly please the Slipped Disc commentariat, who are no doubt offended by the sight of children and adults (audience and musicians) actually enjoying themelves in a Symphony Hall.
Pretty sure the CBSO’s Orchestral Qawwali Project concert was back in 2023 though, so a somewhat odd choice for a 2024 highlight reel
The video description says the clips are of concerts between November 2023 to November 2024. “Celebrating 12 months …”
Thanks GuestX!
Are you also Coming to Viennese New Year or Music at the Movies?
The problem is, Chiminee, is that you have missed the point of the comments above: the video that the CBSO marketing team and Emma Stenning have put out to celebrate the achievements for 2024 is entirely ignoring and diminishing the core music that the CBSO plays and exists for – as Norman points out, the great canon of Western Classical Music. The superb concerts (eg BBC Proms) that they have played last year have been ignored, sidelined, discarded – and this video will be out there for all to see. It does not represent the orchestra at all. It is like a video celebrating the National Gallery simply showing one picture of a tin of Campbell’s Soup. Does that explain the problem?
Western Classical Music is not “Core” for the CBSO Lloyd.
Our New Motto: “Turn up the Joy: Proud to be Birmingham’s Orchestra.”
So our Core is is the People of Birmingham and all Genres and Styles. Western Classical Music is one small Part of that.
Thanks for your interest!
Ok – fine. Then this is not the orchestra I have loved and supported since I was 11, for 55 years. Watch me withdraw my money and my support. I can go elsewhere. Good luck with your new visions.
It’s a 57 second video among a sea of videos that highlight and celebrate the orchestra playing “great canon of Western Classical Music.”
As anyone can see going to the orchestra’s website, the orchestra’s programming is dominated by the “great canon of Western Classical Music.”
Magnifying a 57 second video to be representative of both the day-to-day music making of the CBSO and how it promotes itself is simply disingenuous.
Wasn’t classical music autocratically colonised too?
Not sure what that means. Stop prating the psychobabble of the wokerati.
Double standards following kind of positive racism, I’m afraid:
If a socalled white/western musician composes or plays jazz or any music from other continents outside his tradition, then this is certainly cultural appropriation.
And if musicians who were not born into the western tradition e.g. compose a symphony or sing in an Italian opera then this is decolonization.
It remains to be seen if new audiences can be won and are keen enough to return frequently just as the loyal members and the regular audiences have done.
Speaking for myself, I feel the approach in the last couple of years is misguided and bad decisions have been made. Priorities are wrong and precious time and money is being wasted.
My partner and I used to be members and subscribers who booked about 16 CBSO concerts per season, on average.
The CBSO management has lost its way and standards are slipping.
As a result, we are no longer members and booked just 2 concerts this season. The CBSO will need new audiences to replace those who are leaving.
Nonsense. They used that music to link many excellent clips from throughout the year, including excellent concerts that we attended such as Madam Butterfly with Kazuki and Sibelius with Oramo. Shock horror they use music they recorded from a different project this year.
Another Norman non news story.
But it’s another opportunity for a paid state actor calling itself “I support Emma“ to try to foeman social division in the UK. Not falling for it comrade.
I look forward to Emma complaining that this event https://www.birminghammela.com/ is insufficiently inclusive and demanding that its highlight should be the CBSO performing The Dream of Gerontius.
During this highlights reel I ate some peanuts, had a couple of sips of my white wine, and texted two friends.
This is a message for Allegro, Iain, Geoff Cowley, Venera Martiana and V. Lind. The message is, DNFTT.
Oh, sorry, you don’t know what that means? Do Not Feed The Troll.
I Support Emma is a witty and clever troll. Their contributions are satirical. By responding as you did, you have demonstrated your failure to recognise that satire. Better to keep shtum and enjoy the wit.
Got it. Duh!
“I support Emma” has been very clear in the comments below that any of us who disagree with supposed CBSO policies can just go/leave/cease our support.
I think we now need reassurance/clarification from the CBSO and its CEO on this important platform that this person (or persons) does or does not speak for the CBSO officially: they seem to be setting themselves up as something akin to an official mouthpiece here.
Am I wrong in my assumptions? Norman – can you help on this?
You’re delusional and in denial Lloyd Call us on the main line on 0121 616 6500 and see how far you get!
https://cbso.co.uk/stories/a-new-vision-for-the-cbso
^ this is the Vision Statement that we Signed Off on
https://cbso.co.uk/about-us/staff-trustees
^ here you see the Community Board there Loud and Proud next to Emma and Lord Tony
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/01262018/filing-history
^ and here you see Official Report we made! The Vision Statement is literally #1 in our list of Milestones for the year on page 8. Emma’s Five Resolutions are on page 12 and on page 13 it Locks In the Commitment to Black Lives in Music
It’s all here in text, if you don’t Believe me then read these Official Versions!
So you’ve got a choice Lloyd, you’re part of our Improvements or you’re gonna get left behind…
Oh wow. I am soooo converted. Man. I read all these and threw up with excitement and amazement over breakfast. It is all so exciting, Amazing, fantastic, amazing, Exciting, challenging, amazing, Fantastic, amazing. Amazing. Fantastic. PLEASE let me be President of the Emma Fan Club – can I be in Charge of random capital Letters? That would Be amazing. We could have a 10 Year Plan to Capitalise Everything – in case the Lower case letters Feel left out?
I do wonder about the choice of music in the soundtrack, but most of the photos do seem to capture the orchestra in the process of playing classical music – or in reaching out to the young generation. Much ado about nothing, methinks.
Methinks “I Support Emma” is just a troll, here to get the comment count up along with blood pressure. Also, s/he seems to use the Trump randomized Capitalization style in “their” posts.
ISE also happens to be hilarious, at least to my warped sense of humour.
The CBSO posted this on YouTube – enjoy listening to them playing some Johann Strauss – they could do with more people visiting their channel:
https://youtu.be/Kfncr7D7jWE?si=mSOct-eBm1BVfhyv
If only Emma could raise this level of interest in ticket purchases …
One wonders why people like Emma Stenning want to do the job. Why not go and work with a different group of musicians focussed on the music she wants played?
She clearly has little time for standard orchestral fare and probably knows little about the repertoire judging by her background. ‘I support Emma’ is just trying to up the ante – I don’t think they believe a word they write. They can be safely ignored.
I worked for someone very like Emma Stenning and the whole music organisation went down the pan in the end. There are people at CBSO who could turn this around but they need to stand up and be counted.
I wish people wouldn’t respond to “I Support Emma”. Her only purpose here is to trigger people. I hate any concept of “identity music” just as much as I hate identity politics. Art is the ultimate embodiment of free expression, and should be judged simply in the context as such. The best intentions of art, such as music, is to connect to the shared sense of humanity that bonds us together and lies within us all. At the moment music is commoditized as a product simply defined by age, race and gender, it becomes stripped and separated from that higher purpose. I cherish western classical music not from some outdated sense of entitled privilege or because it was composed by dead white men – it simply stirs my spirit and nurtures my soul. Profound music is a quality in and of itself. The CBSO has clearly lost its way – it’s attempting to package a product to consumers that purposely denies art it’s higher and best-serving purpose.
They are decolonising the repertoire.
Talking of CBSO being “relevant” (hah! – such an amusing idea) – I wonder if the Vienna Phil feels it needs to be “relevant” to the very diverse ethnic population of its city: Austrians, Germans, Turks, Serbs, Hungarians, Bosnians, Romanians, Syrians, Ukrainians – and doubtless many others – including the Jewish population? It does not seem so from their website. They do some fab youth stuff. Great!
What the hell does “relevant” mean anyway? I never felt that great music was “relevant” to me when I discovered it aged 11. I just listened and thrilled to it. Still do. Not sure how it is “relevant” though… Ms Stenning? Do tell.