Lumsden stands down
NewsWinchester Cathedral has announced the departure of Andrew Lumsden as Director of Music after 22 years.
Lumsden, 62, is one of two sons of the organist and chorus master Sir David Lumsden, who died last year.
Winchester Dean Catherine Ogle said: ‘Andy Lumsden has been an outstanding Director of Music at Winchester Cathedral for over two decades. Throughout this time his contribution to the world of English choral music, and sheer musical excellence has been a daily inspiration to congregations and to all fortunate enough to worship here, including growing numbers of people online. In addition to his choral directorship skills, we should not forget his superlative and seemingly effortless playing of the organ. During his time at Winchester Andy Lumsden has trained generations of choristers, contributing not only to their musical and personal formation but also instilling a desire to make worship truly memorable for others. There are many pieces in the cathedral’s repertoire that it will be hard to imagine performed in any other way than with the emotional contours shaped by Andy.’
Unutterably sad, and far too early.
It’s a retirement, not an obituary. 62 years is a perfect age to call it quits.
Indeed, isn’t it nice when people step down gracefully, on a high note?
If it were a retirement I would agree. However, the fact is that he has been hounded out of office by his so-called superiors. Would such a person as AL choose to leave his post at the same time as his deputy is appointed to another cathedral? I think not.
Seems rather fishy doesn’t it?
You do NOT have a CLUE what out are talking about, so kindly pipe down… and learn your place!
Lumsden is the single most talented all-round Church Musician in decades…
And has been FORCED OUT by an ungodly cabal of Trouble-makers, Philistines and ne’erdowells, with ulterior motives.
Assuming it’s him that called it quits, which is a big assumption for an organisation like Winchester… especially with such an oddly worded statement. You only have to look at the rate of departure from the choir. A third down in lay clerk numbers, two of three organists departing simultaneously, another not long since gone (randomly mid term, if memory serves and not to another cathedral or church as far as I can see).
Surely it all begs the question why? Or, no doubt, who…?
I suggest that someone asks the Precentor.
I’d say given the Precentor is unlikely to be reliable, you might to better to ask his Bishop to squeeze some truth out of them all. Sorry if that image puts you off your cornflakes…
CoE Observer: you are probably right. There are far too many clergy (especially in cathedrals and similarly grand foundations) who are in so-called “ministry” for anything but the right reasons.
I am aware of (and have witnessed) numerous unChristian priests in various denominations who simply cannot handle the fact that there are talented musicians who want to serve the church, faithfully. Such is the insecurity of these priests that the musicians in their “care” frequently become the victims of petty, nasty, and downright toxic human beings. Such priests (including Deans and Precentors) should have never been accepted into priesthood in the first place, and should be taken to task by Bishops and others in authority.
Sadly, clergy normally stick together and so it is rare that these bad apples are expunged.
If Dr Lumsden is the victim of such nastiness and injustice, I feel for him.
This is yet another symptom of a church in decline. Very sad.
Red Singer is probably close to the truth. This is the cathedral that prevents local choirs from holding Saturday evening concerts as the afternoon rehearsals might interfere with the flow of visitors (visitors = cash), that charges local groups extortionate amounts to use the building… etc. The Precentor does not appear to be universally popular.
…er maybe the person who’s supposed to be in charge of the music department for instance?
Like Dr Lumsden himself. #ducks
If you read the announcement it says nothing about retiring.
well spotted, I think you might be onto something…
Something is rotten in the state of Denmark
What? AL ‘stepping down’. Timing is all out here. Why would AL only give the congregation and musicians (and indeed the rest of the choral world) only a few months notice…? I’m afraid this feels wrong and isn’t representative of the AL I’ve met. What’s going to be next in the ‘vision and strategy for music’? Scrapping the Choir School?… Not recruiting back to 12 Lay Clerks? – (of course impacted by COVID but surprising for a place that believes in ‘safeguarding the choral tradition’).
Losing three organists In a little over two years is very careless, unless it was planned.
If there’s a new ‘vision and strategy’ for music, it seems quite possible that this was all planned.
Which other organists have left in the last two years please?
That would be me – October 21 actually, so a little longer than 2 years. Then Claudia (Sub-Organist) and Andy, both at the end of this term.
This comment speaks volumes.
To be honest, if the rumours that I have been hearing about some really worrying behaviour are even partly true, it seems odd that the Clergy Discipline Measure hasn’t been used. Perhaps it has but it’s been kept under wraps – wouldn’t be the first time the church swept such things under the carpet. Then the worry is what else might be hidden in the process?
Difficult to know what to think objectively but given when things started to change at Winchester, the timing suggests the Precentor is a common denominator in all this.
Quite so, Red Singer. As I said, the clergy stick together and many think that a dog collar elevates them above the rest of humanity. No wonder people don’t go to church anymore – the hypocrisy of some of these so-called priests puts good people off the idea. Better to pray privately.
The CDM is notoriously unreliable in matters of employment, sadly. Another choral foundation in jeopardy. I have only heard bad things from a whole host of sources, musical and non-musical, about the current CP.
It seems similar comments to those made here have been removed from the Cathedral’s own Facebook post today. Always a sign that ‘there’s nothing to see here’…
I wonder who wanted them deleted?
Red singer is on the money; I am a regular attendee at the Cathedral and I can say from my observations that the Canon Precentor’s role in all this is certainly questionable. On several occasions, I have observed him raising his voice and speaking in an unprofessional manner with members of the music department, often in the proximity of the choristers. The man clearly has a temper he cannot control. He is only interested in himself; his (and the Cathedral’s) rather unhealthy obsession with being on YouTube is seemingly of greater importance than his pastoral duties looking after his charges and the community as a whole. I for one have no time for him, and I gather the musicians absolutely loathe him. There are obviously parallels with the situation as previously reported on this website at Wakefield last year. The first paragraph of the post on the Cathedral’s website about Dr Lumsden’s departure is omitted above, but the language is at best bizarre. I’m also afraid that Caractacus’ comments about revenue don’t surprise me. The place is run as a museum now, not a place of worship.
It has been very sad to observe the goings on at the Cathedral as a member of the congregation for some time now; I know other regular attendees feel the same. Let’s hope that +Winchester gets the message that all is not well in the Cathedral church of his diocese.
Wow… behaving like that with staff is one (clearly unacceptable) thing. Doing so in front of the children would be a matter for serious concern. Surely this is an instant disciplinary matter and, given what you say about tempers, one that would require suspension for the duration of any investigation in order to safeguard those involved? Even if they are overwhelmed by institutional self interest, it would require suspension to protect their… [suspends disbelief] … reputation.
Yes disgraceful behaviour and if I was a choir parent i’d be furious. It’s not only unprofessional but a terrible example to children.
I see from the Cathedral’s relentless crowing on Facebook that they have been nominated by Winchester City Council for a culture award… can’t imagine that sits well with the beleaguered musicians. And how it squares with what Capital Bear says about local choirs and concerts? Presumably the council aren’t aware. Perhaps they should be!
This is all very sad. I must, however , set the record straight that there no parallels with the music department at Wakefield whatsoever. I would as a lay clerk there be happy to stand by comment to the death.
Many apologies if I drew too many parallels, Nick. SD previously reported this last year:
https://slippedisc.com/2023/05/english-cathedral-bans-bullying-precentor-for-10-years/
This is what needs to happen to the Precentor in Winchester – I’m sure the circumstances are potentially different, but the outcome nonetheless needs to be the same.
Right I’m off – Community day at the Cathedral. Should be interesting.
looking for his 5 minutes of fame clearly
Well they will not get anyone like him what a travesty
I wish there was a body similar to the grading system for buildings and trees with the legal authority to preserve British Church Music. There is nothing like it anywhere else. I have heard that musical differences were part of Andy’s decision to leave and I’m afraid the DC will try to dumb down
Hayes not Hagyes!
I was deeply saddened to hear the news that Andrew Lumsden is ‘standing down’ from Winchester Cathedral. Andrew is one of the main reasons I attend the Cathedral services. The choirs are simply outstanding and bring joy to so many. His professional approach and great passion for his role is clear for all to see.
In my view this is neither a retirement or ‘standing down,’ but something much more serious that should be explored and not brushed under the carpet.
That’s what we’re hearing, too. Silence has been imposed by an NDA.
Do you know that for certain? If so, it might explain the (necessary) silence from Any and his family. That is totally to be respected.
Not directly from anyone on either side. But there’s a strong whisper.
Bit more than a whisper…
Indeed! Hopefully, the organist community will read between the lines and stay well away.
My last message, spellcheck changed Andy to Any. Apologies.
I find it most intriguing that there have been no comments from his family! Normally when a retirement is announced, family write about the achievements of their family member and celebrate the next step on the journey of life.
In the case of this highly musical and supportive family, nothing but
silence.
Perhaps they cannot…?
I wonder if the D&C even know anything about Andy’s family? I think that Sir David and Lady Sheila Lumsden would be heartbroken if they were still alive. Are they aware of Sir David’s illustrious career or indeed that of Stephen, Andy’s brother at Intermusica. I can only imagine what David Hill, Andy’s predecessor is thinking right now or David’s predecessor Martin Neary.
The D&C have, unwittingly, unified a major part of not only its congregation, but also that of the music world in disbelief of what has happened.
Sunday afternoon sees the anniversary of the Cathedral Girls Choir, something they are rightly proud of. It will undoubtably attract a larger congregation than usual and should be a wonderful occasion. I image all the members of the D&C will be present and wonder if they stay to answer any questions after the celebrations? I certainly hope so!
Than you ask why???
Winchester Resident maybe onto something. It’s very usual for family and friends not to comment. Dr Lumsden has lots of both I’m sure!
Makes you wonder if an NDA is in place in contravention of the Archbishop’s guidance! Justin Welby tells Church of England to stop using NDAs https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-56817048
Likewise, I couldn’t possibly comment
Certainly does cause a severe outbreak of alarm bells and flashing red lights in the mind…
The situation at the Cathedral is a travesty. Why are the Dean and Chapter treating everyone as idiots? There is only one person to blame in all of this – the Precentor who is a rude bully. He’s the one who should be going, as we all know!
Explains why he’s not getting married in Winchester Cathedral ?
Yes!
I have had the pleasure of collaboration with Andrew Lumsden over many years; he is one of the finest church musicians still working for the C o E. This all sounds very odd: the timing, the language and the sense of stories untold. I am afraid that Cathedral Clergy often get things wrong (look at Barry Rose and St. Pauls, or more recently the shambles at Sheffield Cathedral). The sad thing is that no-one benefits if clergy cannot look after their musicians; good musicians leave, the services become second rate, and every one loses out. I fear that there is now often total ignorance in the Chapter of how precious musical talent is – and it needs support and encouragement to bear fruit.
Excellent musician and a great loss to the church
I wonder if there was an issue in maintaining two Assistants at Winchester. Claudia is departing and perhaps the Dean & Chapter did not want to replace her and (therefore) save a salary. If Andrew objected he might have met with disapproval. Time will tell how they advertise the post(s).
Your average assistant organist costs rather less than a newly qualified school teacher… most no longer have housing either. Given the size of the organisation, that would be fairly small fry unless, of course, you resent spending all that hard earned tourist dollar on something like music for the liturgy.
Is it even remotely feasible that NDA’s have been forced upon the Lumsden family, as the rumours on this forum appear to indicate?
Norman Lebrecht seems to think they have.
Therefore the Dean and Chapter need to quickly deny that they would even consider issuing DNA’s so as to follow the wishes of the Archbishop of Canterbury.
Silence will not make this problem go away, so please for all our sanity, just confirm that Winchester Cathedral has not, and would not, issue an order to silence anyone by way of an NDA or something similar.
Whilst on this subject perhaps the Dean and Chapter can also confirm that their public Facebook page would not be censored unless something was derogatory, blasphemous or illegal.
I have worked in cathedrals and can confirm that Facebook posts are censored; however that is no different to a lot of organisations.
I know from people in Winchester that the precentor has brought in changes which have not been popular with some of his staff, but organisational decisions are not always popular. Sometimes changes have to be made though.
However, a thing that Winchester D & C are clearly doing, and over the years have done many times, is not appreciating the strength of feeling in their community, but also that the value of an individual is not in £ alone.
The reason many worship at Winchester is what AL’s musical direction brings to the service; organisations have services there because of the musical content; many people want their children to be choristers at Winchester because of Al; Al has the ability to turn something that is good into something magical; but above all AL is just a really good guy who will leave not just a whole in Winchester but a gaping chasm.
I’m told from reliable sources that the so called “precentor” has had it in for AL for a while and has been making up all sorts of legal accusations to get him sacked. Coupled with bullying behaviour, intimidation and arrogance, one can understand why AL has had enough. I also understand that this is just the tip of the iceberg and that the unpleasant nastiness, unprofessional behaviour and general incompetence of the “precentor” is making other employees seriously consider their future involvement in the liturgy and music of this great cathedral. He needs to go and for his vile, bullying and disgustingly unchristian behaviour to be exposed.
There absolutely must be an immediate investigation by the newly-appointed Bishop of Winchester into this malfeasance in his cathedral. The known facts are that the precentor, appointed in 2019, has had a vendetta against Andrew Lumsden since before Christmas 2023, if not longer. With or without the the Dean’s knowledge, he pursued various legal options to get rid of him because there was no formal basis for dismissal. Prior to this, in 2021, the organist George Castle was bullied and eventually “made redundant” by this same precentor. An investigation at that time found that there was indeed bullying in the workplace. Nothing further was done. The cathedral musicians are all too aware of this man’s day-to-day behaviour. It is not known, in the Lumsden situation, whether there was a payoff, or an NDA, or both. Only an investigation by the Bishop will bring any knowledge at all of what has really been going on here. I understand several individuals and groups have already written the Bishop to demand such an investigation.
But looking down the road: what church musician in his/her right mind is going to want to work for this awful man? What is the future of the music here?
Is there a single English cathedral that could be counted a happy place to work? Or are they all misery all the way down?
Such a travesty. 3 amazing musicians lost in 3 years. As has been said, who would want to take over, no one in their right mind whilst the current regime exists. If I was a chorister mum I’m not sure I would be happy for him/ her to stay. Will they be able to attract new singers? The Precentor is a bully, not just to staff. I had cause to complain as a volunteer. There was a token meeting but nothing else. I know I’m not the only volunteer to have complained. AL is too much of a gent. to reveal anything but he is surrounded by people who admire and support him and have much to thank him for.
If the Precentor is the bully that he has been made out to be on this thread, then – as an alleged victim – you should write to Dean and copy in the Bishop as well as the cathedral’s HR manager with a formal complaint. If you get no response then write to the local press and Slipped Disc.
Today the Evensong celebrating 25 years of the Cathedral Girls’ Choir was truly celebratory with a packed Quire hearing magnificent music beautifully prepared.
Yet there was one significant absentee from the D & C – the subject of so many adverse comments above.
As chairman of a county-wide choral festival which recently marked its centenary and for the last 25 years held its annual large-scale performances in the Cathedral, I know that it was the current Precentor’s personal decision not to welcome any more Saturday evening choral-orchestral concerts for this community organisation. He knew nothing of the historical links between the Cathedral and such bodies and clearly is not interested in maintaining or fostering such links with the ‘mother church’.
Professional organists are a close-knit community. An unwelcoming church will be avoided by all of them –
something cataclysmic for our wonderful Cathedral and possibly a tragic destruction of so much built up by AL and his eminent predecessors.
A serious high-level review of what is happening is urgently required for the sake of music, the city AND the Cathedral itself.
The 25th anniversary evensong of the excellent Winchester Girls’ choir was celebrated today. A wonderful occasion and some stellar singing.
Two former Winchester precentors made an effort to attend along with former organists and directors from over the years. The current ‘titular’ precentor was however, not in attendance. This must now raise questions as to how tenable his position can be.
One of the former Winchester precentors was not formally invited to attend by the D and C, but did so anyway, having been there when the choir was first formed. The current one, whose job it was to be there, chose not to attend. Speaks volumes.
Indeed, another previous Precentor who was not even invited, made a massive effort to attend anyway. Doubtless Canon Michael St. John Channell, another recent Precentor would also have been with them in spirit from the heights of Heaven. He it was who started the Congregation Nave Choir in 2007, to give less experienced singers an opportunity to sing in the Cathedral. Inclusivity in action.
Perhaps he was busy on the phone calling or emailing current (and indeed former) cathedral clergy to let them know that the news is fake…?
Does this sound like the actions of an organisation with nothing to hide…?
If the Dean and Chapter think all this will simply go away, they are mistaken. Some questions: 1. Is Dr Lumsden’s departure entirely of his choosing, or has pressure been applied to make him go before his planned retirement date? 2. If so, who applied that pressure, and for what reason? 3. Is it true that he has signed an NDA, despite Archbishop Justin’s direction that the CofE should not use them, ever? 4. Why was the current precentor absent from yesterday’s 25th anniversary evensong for the Girls’ Choir? If Winchester Cathedral hopes to recruit any musicians in the coming months, these and other questions need answers. The truth will out. Best wishes to Dr. Lumsden.
the truth will out indeed. the day it does, the world will most certainly become a better place
I’ve just asked and found out he was away on annual leave, booked months ago before the event was organised.
How convenient (even if true)
Im not sure I’ve ever seen a more myopic thread. Can’t you see what is really (really) happening? Lumsden- once great- is not suited to be a modern DoM, where there is more to do that rehearsing choirs. He’s gone off the boil a long time ago (even musically) and has, by common consent, been applying and not getting senior promotions for some years.
Common consent by whom? Rather at odds with the views of the REAL hard hitting experts and musicians who are lending support to AL… one might almost think such an inaccurate comment might have come from someone with an unpleasant axe to grind…
It will be a joy to know when Church Mouse last saw and heard him at work, either in the Cathedral, or with the very fine musicians in the Waynflete Singers.
Whilst everyone is rightly entitled to their opinion, you are clearly (in my opinion and the vast majority of those commenting on this and the other multiple threads), wrong. Tuning in at least twice a week to the broadcasts (which may or may not circumvent performing rights – although that’s another story), the music from the choir of Winchester Cathedral is nothing short of sensational. That being said, you clearly have some internal information if you are able to comment so publicly on his non-musical contributions. The last time I checked, the world’s best musicians, were musicians – who focused on world class music, day in and day out via (quite obviously) rehearsals. If you believe that a ‘modern DOM’ should be an administrative musician… well, you clearly haven’t understood the cathedral that you seem to have insight into. As for publicly ‘shaming’ Doctor Lumsden about roles he may have gone for (and subsequently pulled out of)… well… don’t you look good. Have a blessed end to the week.
Cathedralmouse, I’m not quite sure what planet you’re from, but speaking as a Cathedral organist myself, I spend a huge portion of my time working with singers in rehearsals – it is without exception the most important thing I do in my day-to-day life. Directing choirs is by definition what a Director of Music does, and Lumsden is one of THE best in the business at both. That is a fact and anyone who knows him respects him as the truly great musician that he is. Of course us DOM’s have a plethora of other (mostly mundane) tasks to undertake, but our work with choristers and adult singers is the shop window for our Cathedrals, and it is one that Andy Lumsden truly excels at. For the record, I watched part of the webcast of last Sunday’s Evensong. The sound and sheer commitment he drew from the choir, especially the choristers, in the Parry anthem was epic. He has most certainly not gone off the boil – far from it.
From what we’ve all been hearing and reading about in this thread, it seems that Dr Lumsden has been subjected to a prolonged campaign of bullying and intimidation in a Cathedral where the working environment is poisonous. Poor fellow. If I was in his shoes, I’m not sure that I could continue to do such a stirling job. It would certainly be a real challenge to continue to inspire and motivate the singers in my charge, and that is a further testament to his extraordinary gifts and aptitude for the role he has undertaken for the past 22 years. Fortunately the clergy where I work are lovely colleagues, but it is well-known on the circuit that Winchester’s good reputiation has been, how shall we say, substantially tarnished by the antics of one individual’s ill-considered and downright unpleasant behaviour over the past few years.
So – back to your post. I’m now wondering if you have a personal axe to grind as the tone of your insipid message suggests you are personally involved. Maybe you are aren’t enjoying being challenged by those who are better qualified to comment than yourself – I’m afraid they are in the right and you, most definitely, are not.
Hello Canon Andy
@cathedralmouse
try again anonymouse… Bit further away than that ☺️
I shared an office with Dr Lumsden. I know how hard he works on the non-musical side of things, even coming into the office when he’s supposed to be on holiday, in his shorts, to do admin. Also anyone with half an ear can tell the positive difference he makes to the sound of a choir. I remember the change in sound of the choir when he came back from sabbatical. It took four days, and the boys voices suddenly had a sparkle that they hadn’t had in the previous months. He is a treasure and your words are vile.
I too remember that.
I also recall the excited comments of Choral friends who sang under Dr Lumsden’s direction then, and during his leadership of the RSCM Summer School in New Zealand.
What utter tosh! I have never read such a disrespectful comment. As an attendee of celebratory events at Winchester Cathedral what inspires me is the quires, the music the brilliant arrangement, I have had the privilege of hearing ALs musical direction and playing. Working in education had put me into contact with various employees at Winchester. AL is a generous human being. The boys and girls are anazing. I was shocked at reading the Facebook announcement. I’m saddened at the inside vitriolic atmosphere that seems to be prevalent. This is not what Christianity means to me I’m appalled! Saddened!
Still waiting for that ‘supporting evidence’…
Interested to understand why “Cathedralmouse” suddenly gained an additional “r” becoming cathedralmouse(r) Two different people posting, perhaps? Attention to detail is so important.
As an ex-Winchester chorister myself, Dr. Lumsden is far from ‘off the boil’, and the music under his watch has never been greater. What a travesty he is “resigning”. Personally I think the precentor has a lot of questions to answer.
You’re a buffoon, or should I say mouse. Please tell us who these ‘common consent’ people are?
I wonder who this may be? I can guess. You are not precenting…sorry presenting well!
@cathedralmouse – diminutive in stature but not ambition. Ahhhhh, the coat of many colours…… so sad
I think you’ll find that many people are looking on this thread in wonder at how vicious and vile people can be and how misrepresentative of the musical community you are.
I’m also an organist-ex of a nearby Cathedral- and I’ve chosen to articulate a different perspective and tell some home truths.
But of course different view equals axe to grind.
Like I said- myopic.
Do feel free to provide proof to evidence your various statements.
Organist-ex “of a nearby Cathedral”? That rather narrows your comments down… It’s a very small world after all…
Enjoy your day
I would suggest that this is either the Precentor or a friend/relative of his who is hitting back. As is said elsewhere, no musician would write this kind of thing but I know plenty of clergy who would. How about some leadership from the Dean or Bishop?
You are very probably correct. Derby’s not very far away after all.
Indeed it does – especially when an “organist of a nearby cathedral” decide to “resign” (becoming an ex organist) a few years ago under strong rumours of, wait for it, bullying. Funnily enough the same person is a close friend of the bullying precentor. @cathedralmouse et tu, brute?
I, as no doubt many reading this, know the organists of all the ‘local cathedrals’, and those further away. And their predecessors. Not one of them would take the view point you assert. That smoke screen seems awfully thin.
Does this then mean that ‘cathedralmouse’ is not being entirely truthful? Certainly they seem to have very strong and rather scathing opinions about Lumsden which, over this whole debacle, have not been reiterated elsewhere or by anyone else.
Our mouse would appear to know Lumsden, and yet has no time for his musicality. That must surely rule out a musician.
They also seem privy to information which, if it is true, suggests a working relationship with Lumsden, perhaps in a supervisory role.
So it would not be overly wild speculation to suggest that our mouse is a non-musician who works with Lumsden, doesn’t like him, and seems to be privy to information about him.
Well, that narrows it down a bit.
Let us hope, for the sake of our poor mouse that the rumour of the NDA is not true.
Rumour????
Sadly, not… Truth will out, of course, as it always does. Karma is a wonderful leveler…
Derby, perhaps?
It’s a very small world…
How about you come out of your little mouse hole and tell us which ‘Cathedral’ you were organist of. I smell some very bad cheese.
Do you really think we’ll believe that you’re an ex cathedral organist?
This has appeared on Winchester Cathedral’s Facebook entry, and might offer some reassurance about the future of music there:
Winchester Cathedral Statement About the Future of Music at Winchester Cathedral
Our Music Strategy was presented to key participants of the Choral Foundation back in January 2023 and was warmly received. It confirmed the full commitment of Winchester Cathedral to a thriving Foundation with, at its heart, the continuing musical excellence of our Cathedral Choirs, including our lay clerks, boys, and girls. Despite the financial pressures of the last two years, the Cathedral has heavily increased investment in music which we have no plans to cut, quite the reverse. What we are doing is spending even more on girls’ voices without reducing our commitment to the boys’ numbers or to our ambition to increase the number of lay clerks. We are increasing our outreach/access choirs with a view to strengthening the great choral tradition here. By expanding the number of choirs, we can offer participation to many more children who now benefit from the joy of singing in the cathedral. This too is excellence: we are proud that we reach more children who might not otherwise ever consider this was possible.
We enjoy a very good working relationship with The Pilgrims’ School and our boy choristers will continue to receive excellent education there. Our plans include increasing the bursaries to children of the parents who would otherwise be unable to afford the fees, so that more boys can enjoy the magnificent benefits and opportunities offered by the school.
The Choral Foundation is a highly valuable spiritual and cultural institution in its own right, and a key feature of worship at the Cathedral. With the additional opportunity that digital brings, the potential for the power of English Cathedral choral music at Winchester to inspire, teach and transform lives in Winchester and beyond is enormous. We will continue the tradition of far-sightedness of previous generations to adapt and grow the Choral Foundation to serve everyone in the future.
For the wellbeing and protection of all our clergy and staff, it is Cathedral policy not to comment on confidential HR matters.
Only thing DECENTTTT about Winchester. They have got this so wrong! wish Andy all the best 😉
Do please sight Private Eye this week. An item in it will give you a good idea of what has been going on in Winchester…
The Dean & Chapter at Winchester Cathedral should be ashamed of themselves. And from what I’ve heard, the Precentor in particular should hang his head in shame. What an embarrassment he is. Andy Lumsden is, by a country mile, one of the most talented cathedral musicians in the country (if not the best). I would not be a professional singer if it hadn’t been for him. For him to leave out like this is a travesty and an embarrassment for them all. As soon as I heard that this current Precentor didn’t even bother to turn up to the anniversary of the girls choir just confirms that he is a waste of space. How did the Dean allow it?! You were lucky to have him and you’ll quickly regret letting him go.
Tragically they probably won’t, because the Precentor is obsessed with the Junior Choir… ‘rumour’ has it that his Son was rejected for the Cathedral Choir, but made it into the Junior Choir… someone else’s words not mine… I couldn’t possibly comment.
Interesting article published in Private Eye.
THE departure of Winchester Cathedral’s hugely respected music director Andrew Lumsden was dressed up as an amicable farewell after 22 years in the job, but it’s nothing of the kind. Amid speculation about why he’s being forced out, there was no comment from Lumsden, who is subject to a non-disclosure agreement. The only certainty is he’s done nothing to deserve it.
Much has been made of leaked information about plans by the Dean and Chapter to increase diversity and inclusion with changes to the music.
But insiders tell O’Boulez that ideology here is a front for the ambitions of precentor Andy Trenier.
Trenier, who arrived in 2019, introduced livestreamed services during lockdown – no bad thing, but they continued afterwards with scant regard for the rights of professional musicians involved. There were rows. In 2021, assistant music director George Castle was forced out by Trenier for no valid reason, as a subsequent HR appeal established. And although Trenier was found to have acted “inappropriately”, the dean allowed him to turn his attention to Lumsden – who experienced what one choir member called
“intolerable working conditions”. Lay clerks in the choir have meanwhile shrunk from 12 to eight; another departs shortly.
Lumsden’s job has been advertised. As this column went to press, a meeting was planned between the dean and powerful figures in British choral music.
So sad with all of this.
Having been a lay clerk in Winchester, this article, perhaps more than any other, makes me fear for the future of the choral foundation I dedicated myself to for 11 years – widely regarded as the finest in the country. And, of course, there are all the hundreds of generations of musicians proud to have served in the Cathedral for centuries.
https://thecritic.co.uk/what-future-for-winchester-cathedral-choir/
As for Andy’s treatment…The silence from within the cathedral is deafening. If there is no issue, then the Cathedral need to
say so. However, the rumours are also deafening, so isn’t it about time that the Cathedral address this once and for all? At the moment, it’s all smoke and mirrors, a far cry from the transparency that the CofE champions. Surely the D and C must realise that this is now in the national press. The rumour mill will only gain momentum, and that rarely results in anything but heightened speculation and more questions…
What has actually happened?
Who knew about it?
Did anyone try and intervene?
The longer this goes on, the more untenable this is for the D and C. Rumour has it that there has been an NDA imposed on Andy L despite NDAs not being permitted within the CofE anymore. Is the Cathedral silence because of an NDA they have put in place? Oh, the irony…
If anyone else within the organisation knows what has happened, are they also subject to an NDA – hence the silence? I’m no expert on such matters.
This is a matter of national importance now, with so many things to address. Is this now in the hands of the Bishop of Winchester? Given how long this has been rumbling on and the escalation of the situation, I feel that it now needs to be dealt with by the very highest office, given all the implications that the rumours might infer with a thorough investigation required. Unless, of course, there is nothing to see here…
The cathedral has behaved abominable and hypocritically
I have had the great good fortune to sing for Edward Higginbottom as a lay-clerk at New College, for Christopher Robinson, John Rutter, Sir Stephen Cleobury amongst others during my association with the Eton College choral courses, for Ralph Allwood, of course, and latterly for David Hill and Andy Lumsden as a deputy lay-clerk at Winchester. Andy was and is up there amongst the very best. I am deeply shocked and saddened by what seems to have happened within the cathedral community in the twenty years since I left. I note that Charles Stewart, former precentor, was amongst the clergy at Andy’s recent wedding, with the current Bishop of Basingstoke presiding, and David Hill directing the music. That seems to be several votes of continuing confidence, not covered by NDAs!
PS Dean Wesley Carr’s dismissal of Martin Neary from Westminster Abbey seems to pale into insignificance beside all of this.
I am a former chorister of Lichfield Cathedral, long before Andrew Lumsden was the organist there. I visited Lichfield many times and attended services when Andrew was Organist and Master of the Choristers. I discussed church music with him several times. In response to a suggestion of mine that it would be good to hear Stainer’s “I saw the Lord”, on Trinity Sunday, he confirmed how much “the boys love it” (though it wasn’t sung that year). I admired his positive, decisive and wonderfully intelligent leadership of the choir and I cannot imagine how any Cathedral could not be the better for having the privilege of Andrew leading its musical offering.
I was unaware until today of the goings on in Winchester, but my curiosity was aroused when listening to choral evensong from St Mary le Bow and noting that Andrew was the organist. If Andrew would like to be appointed as organist at another cathedral in the UK, my advice them is to snatch him quickly; you can’t do better.
If Andrew doesn’t want another appointment, I implore him to give us all the benefit of his music in recitals, as did the late Sir George Thalben Ball.