The future is Dutch. The rest look old
NewsRotterdam’s swoop for a 22 year-old baton yesterday confirms the trend in Dutch orchestras to go for youth, when all others plump for familiarity and the illusion of name recognition by elderly audiences.
In Holland, the average age of conductors is now around 30.
The Concertgebouw has a Finn of 26.
Rotterdam has Lahav Shani, 33, and Tarmo, 22
Dutch National Opera and the Netherlands Philharmonic have Lorenzo Viotti, 32.
The radio philharmonic has Karina Canellakis, 40.
Why do UK and US orchestras stich to middleaged white men?
Maybe because endangered breed that is the middle-aged white man tends to know what he is doing in front of an orchestra, rather than learning on the job? Conducting has always been one of those professions where experience counts.
Bingo. Give me Haitink in his 70s and 80s, Blomstedt in his 70, 80, 90s, Klemperer, Jochum, etc. anyday over anyone in his 20s.
(Well, I would have loved to hear Karajan in his 20s as well, but you get the point…)
When i went to concerts the conductors used to be legends Karajan / klemperer
Age-old problem is, that getting experience as a conductor is a catch-22. You need the experience to be a good conductor, but to get the experience, you need to be a good conductor. This is an age-old hurdle at the beginning of the conducting professional path.
Unless, of course, you are rich and/or have connections. Would Koussevitzky have ever gotten to be one of the greats if he wasn’t able to hire his own orchestra?
Endangered breed? It represents probably more than 90% of the current conductor landscape. I guess you want it to be 100% in order not to feel threatened? Sad.
Age does not matter. What matters is if you’re Finn or not.
Quite right Andrew. Conducting professional orchestras is not for kids just out of short pants. Fine with pianists, violinists- the more youthful & brilliant often the better. Too many young conductors are thrust in front of top orchestras far too young- when they hardly know one side of the baton from the other & (more importantly) how to handle the players under them who are older & more experienced generally. But Classical Music’s obsesssion with youth- merely a desperate attempt to save a dying art form.
The answer is simple: men improve with the years.
Therefore it must be derived that most UK and US orchestras are not going far enough. The Celebrated Skillful Orchestra in our enchanted universe finds this lesson true: the Ultractogenarian Iconic Treasured Man is the key to a paradise enwrought with golden and silver light.
No more mad in pursuit of a climax, in truth, incapable of reaching it, the old man will show that the real pleasure is in the journey, imparting a new trick on us every day. Inside a forest, right at the edge of it under the humid trees, near a lake or right inside of it. A king sitting upon a chair of gold.
“Please to have filled the eyes
Or the discerning years,
Delighted to be but wise,
For men improve with the years;
And yet, and yet,
Is this my dream, or the truth?”
Gosh do I have fat fingers today. How deeply embarrassing, and my apologies to all.
“Pleased to have filled the eyes
Or the discerning ears,
Delighted to be but wise,
For men improve with the years;
And yet, and yet,
Is this my dream, or the truth?”
Tarmo Peltokoski is super talented and the best ‘young’ conductor right now. The Concertgebouw should have picked him instead.
Replace “white men” with Jews/Muslims or whatever, and let us see how brave you are, Mr. Lebrecht.
And they are all Italians or Austro Germanic.
We need more MADE IN ENGLAND we.
Finns are acceptable but we want to see more British.
Don’t worry, at this very moment the Truss government is devising plans to pour even more money into music education, especially for those without rich parents, and to continue to neglect the underpaid bankers. (Warning: this may be irony.)
And latinos?
And latinos?
What do you think?
Agree with Andrew. One of the problems with orchestras these days is that the conductors are not “seasoned” enough. They may have technical skill and great ambition (and I applaud that). But there is something great to be said about living with repertoire and having it grow inside your soul. It’s not simply about performing.
I’m not sure that’s so very true. The CBSO, SCO, RLPO, BBC Philharmonic and BBC NOW don’t have middle-aged white men. We need more women but the CBSO and BBC NOW were until recently both led by women (and previously Bournemouth as well). Also some former bright young talents, like Vasily Petrenko in Liverpool, are now a bit older and have moved on to other orchestras (the RPO in his case) – surely he shouldn’t be fired or passed over for the sin of a few more birthdays?
Remember Bringuier?
Not to mention that the mighty Philadelphia Orchestra went for young a few years ago with disastruous results. True, things looked good for a few years, the kid is talented. But why it took everyone so long to figure out that he has no brains?
Sorry, but I will take Noseda, Honeck, Vanska, etc. every day.
Philadelphia has a history of going young, at least they appeared young until a couple of these recent hires: Stokowski, Ormandy, Muti, and Nezet-Seguin were all in their 30s when they started there.
But since I started going to their concerts, which was around the middle of the Muti period, the best they’ve sounded was when the much older Sawallisch was on the podium, especially the last few seasons at the Academy of Music.
“Why do UK and US orchestras stich to middleaged white men?” – Wait, are they less “white” if they are young?
What on Earth are you saying?
If they are hiring them because they are young, I have bad news… they’re all going to get old.
Why do UK and US orchestras stick to middle-aged white men? The answer, I’d suggest, is simple: bums on seats!
Don’t forget Duncan Ward (33) at Philharmonic South Netherlands and Anja Bihlmaier (44) at Residence Orchestra
I like the fact that these Dutch orchestra’s give young talented conductors a chance. However, I don’t understand why they always seem to look for young foreign conductors. You can’t tell me that there isn’t a single young and gifted musician at one of the Dutch conservatories who knows how to handle a baton and who deserves a chance. I’m not saying that the Dutch should only focus on Dutch musicians for nationalistic reasons or whatever. The would clearly make no sense at all. I just feel that there’s a certain disbalance. At this year’s conducting competition in Rotterdam there wasn’t a single Dutch participant (at least not to my knowledge). Is there really no talent in the Netherlands?
I suspect it’s not about talent, but more about temperament. Dutch conductor and orchestra partnerships usually work well, but when it goes wrong…
Perhaps the Dutch are more open to risk-taking, see youth as a door to new ideas and exciting evenings in the concert hall, and as a magnet for an open-minded, curious audience?
Maybe the US management teams feel – wrongly? – dependent on charitable contributions from middle-aged rich white people and feel they prefer the ‘tried and proven?’ (Has anybody asked them?) Albeit, the late Sybil Harrington in NY heavily funded the Metropolitan Opera with many millions despite James Levine’s startling youthful age at the time.
Anyway. Good luck and success to them all.
Maybe because going with young conductors has bitten too many orchestras in the butt more often than not. (At least here in the USA)
I believe you can make the same argument for going too far in the other direction. Muti in Chicago? Maazel was well liked in N.Y., but did he really bring anything new or interesting to the table (besides ever slower tempi)? Did he bring any interpretive insights worth mentioning? Giulini made some great recordings in L.A., but he also conducted probably the slowest and most lack luster “Eroica” that anyone could possibly imagine (what was he thinking!). Sawallisch was a very great musician, but he didn’t exactly light up Philadelphia either (my understanding was that he was battling health issues).
All those comments… about experience, I’m 25 years in the Rotterdam Philharmonic, if you know the job the musicians will accept you immediately, no matter what age you are. Tarmo knows exactly what he is doing, as well as Lahav Shani and before Yannick Nezet Seguin. Orchestra and conductors work together if they like each other. That results in fantastic concerts. Maybe if you have doubts, just come to one of our concert and have this great experience. It’s really fun and beautiful and on an incredible level.
“Even if you know that conducting is difficult, you must be a seventy-year-old to understand just how difficult it is.”
— Richard Strauss (quoted in Charles Munch’s memoir “I Am a Conductor”)
“If you ain’t Dutch you ain’t much.”
Toscanini at 19 was such a rank amateur conducting Aida in Rio de Janeiro he never got another gig. If only he’d waited another 40 years, he’d have been properly seasoned.
Because they are better. Remember the maestro Haitink?
Headline doesn’t make sense. None of the conductors listed are Dutch.
“Dutch Orchestras Ditch Gray-Haired Men”
“Save Money, Hiring Young in Holland”
“Netherlands: Conductor Training Ground”
“Conductor’s Rotter? Damn, Fresh Faces Only”
“[Dutch Orchestra] Hiring Conductor: Post CV on Twitter”
“No Conducting for Old Men”
The young conductor has little insight to offer to me. At least not the profound insights I have experienced from real Titans in 60 years of concert going.
Maybe because the inexperienced cost less. That would explain most of it. Investing in the future is a great idea if you have money to invest with. I’d rather engage a conductor who has several Beethoven and Brahms cycles under his (or her?) belt, or buy a 300 year old golden era strad for my concertmaster than bet on a 22 year old in a tie.
…maybe because Dutch cannot attract/afford someone old and established?
I think this might be closer to the truth than we might suspect…